NetRexx at IBM....

[BRADLEY]

Hi NetRexx-ers.....

In the September 15, 1997 issue of LANTIMES, there is an article titled "IBM
reinventing itself with Java". The article states that "IBM is putting more
resources into Java than any other company, including Sun...." And again if
you look on www.ibm.com/java you can read how Java seems to be turning into a
huge language, for IBM.

My question is: How does IBM feel about NetRexx? Is NetRexx just an experiment
or does IBM include NetRexx in its Java investment? When IBM does its Java
development -- are the programmers developing Java natively or through
NetRexx? Do the programmers have a choice as to which approach to take
(NetRexx verses native Java) or does IBM want its development done purely
through Java and not NetRexx? What I am looking for is IBM's attitude towards
NetRexx verses plain Java development.

Thanks in advance,

Brad Simonin.

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[Dennis Peterson]

There must be something "going on" around the world. I to have been having concerns
of late as to the future of NetRexx. This was mostly brought on by attempting to keep up
with all the Java releases from Sun. Since NR is a special project of IBM Fellow Mike
Cowlishaw, and since it will continue to require "catch-up" updates as well as bug fixes,
and since I and others are becoming ever more dependant upon it, I have a concern
that the good will of IBM may run out.

This is in no way a critique of the gargantuan effort of Mike and others, rather, a bit of a
wonderment as to what the future holds for NR. I was going to request that my company
add NetRexx to its list of approved languages and it would help sell the idea if some
kind of going forward policy from IBM were in evidence.

Sleepless in Seattle
Dennis Peterson

On Fri, 19 Sep 97 23:42:34 +0100, [hidden email] wrote:

>In 19970919.114223.BRADLEY@NMDA, on 09/19/97
>   at 11:42 AM, [hidden email] said:
>
>[..]
>
>>My question is: How does IBM feel about NetRexx? Is NetRexx just an
>>experiment or does IBM include NetRexx in its Java investment? When IBM
>>does its Java development -- are the programmers developing Java natively
>>or through NetRexx? Do the programmers have a choice as to which approach
>>to take (NetRexx verses native Java) or does IBM want its development
>>done purely through Java and not NetRexx? What I am looking for is IBM's
>>attitude towards NetRexx verses plain Java development.
>
>I think that Mike (or other IBMers, for what matters) are in a far better
>position to answer your questions, but I'd like to add in advance some
>thoughts, which come from years of having to do with IBM as a company and
>with some people within it.
>
>First of all, I wouldn't be surprised if in IBM only a few knew that
>NetRexx exists, let alone use it. IBM is a big company, with many
>different labs, and Java  development inside it takes place in many
>different places (I remember Chris  Paradine naming someone at Haifa
>-Israel- working on Java inside IBM). Bottom line, not everyone knows what
>others are doing.
>
>Moreover, not every tool is right for every job; NetRexx as it is now is a
>great language but it lacks things like a visual builder, which
>compromises its use as a GUI-building tool. [Incidentally, building a
>visual tool for NetRexx is the reason why I've started the VNRJ mailing
>list, which right now is in coma -- a real pity!]
>
>So, what does it mean for me that NetRexx is not used everywhere within
>IBM? Absolutely nothing. I, as a consultant, must solve some problems,
>which would be harder to solve if NetRexx wasn't around. I helped (along
>with my RXDbase  and RXFile libs) starting/building at least three big
>projects here in Italy with  NetRexx, and I can say that having people
>like mr. Mike Cowlishaw developing  NetRexx is far more important than
>having IBM as a whole blessing it. As a matter of fact, IBM is trying to
>push everywhere VA Java, and anyone knows about it. I've bought it, and
>I'm helping others (mainly sw developers) developing with it and
>integrating it with NetRexx; guess what? The problems always arise from
>the VAge side (expecially with 2nd and 3rd party beans).  That program is
>chock full of bugs and annoying 'features' (although it is truly
>powerful). Luckily, when everything else is snafu, you always have your
>nrc.cmd/bat.
>
>I know I may sound cynical, but I feel more comfortable depending on
>people I know and I respect and their works than to some obscure, faceless
>management. :-)
>
>--
>Max Marsiglietti,
>PC-Magazine Italy (Technical contributor)
>MaxBase 1.08 and RXFile 1.16 author
>
>                       NetRexx projects Home pages
>
>RXDbase: (alphabetical order)
>http://www.bmtmicro.com/catalog/mb-web
>http://www.javasuperstore.com/products/max.html
>http://www.ososoft.com/RXDBASE.HTM
>RXFile:
>http://www.GeoCities.com/SiliconValley/Park/4218
>
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>[hidden email]
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[Massimiliano Marsiglietti]

In 19970919.114223.BRADLEY@NMDA, on 09/19/97
   at 11:42 AM, [hidden email] said:

[..]

>My question is: How does IBM feel about NetRexx? Is NetRexx just an
>experiment or does IBM include NetRexx in its Java investment? When IBM
>does its Java development -- are the programmers developing Java natively
>or through NetRexx? Do the programmers have a choice as to which approach
>to take (NetRexx verses native Java) or does IBM want its development
>done purely through Java and not NetRexx? What I am looking for is IBM's
>attitude towards NetRexx verses plain Java development.

I think that Mike (or other IBMers, for what matters) are in a far better
position to answer your questions, but I'd like to add in advance some
thoughts, which come from years of having to do with IBM as a company and
with some people within it.

First of all, I wouldn't be surprised if in IBM only a few knew that
NetRexx exists, let alone use it. IBM is a big company, with many
different labs, and Java  development inside it takes place in many
different places (I remember Chris  Paradine naming someone at Haifa
-Israel- working on Java inside IBM). Bottom line, not everyone knows what
others are doing.

Moreover, not every tool is right for every job; NetRexx as it is now is a
great language but it lacks things like a visual builder, which
compromises its use as a GUI-building tool. [Incidentally, building a
visual tool for NetRexx is the reason why I've started the VNRJ mailing
list, which right now is in coma -- a real pity!]

So, what does it mean for me that NetRexx is not used everywhere within
IBM? Absolutely nothing. I, as a consultant, must solve some problems,
which would be harder to solve if NetRexx wasn't around. I helped (along
with my RXDbase  and RXFile libs) starting/building at least three big
projects here in Italy with  NetRexx, and I can say that having people
like mr. Mike Cowlishaw developing  NetRexx is far more important than
having IBM as a whole blessing it. As a matter of fact, IBM is trying to
push everywhere VA Java, and anyone knows about it. I've bought it, and
I'm helping others (mainly sw developers) developing with it and
integrating it with NetRexx; guess what? The problems always arise from
the VAge side (expecially with 2nd and 3rd party beans).  That program is
chock full of bugs and annoying 'features' (although it is truly
powerful). Luckily, when everything else is snafu, you always have your
nrc.cmd/bat.

I know I may sound cynical, but I feel more comfortable depending on
people I know and I respect and their works than to some obscure, faceless
management. :-)

--
Max Marsiglietti,
PC-Magazine Italy (Technical contributor)
MaxBase 1.08 and RXFile 1.16 author

                       NetRexx projects Home pages

RXDbase: (alphabetical order)
http://www.bmtmicro.com/catalog/mb-web
http://www.javasuperstore.com/products/max.html
http://www.ososoft.com/RXDBASE.HTM
RXFile:
http://www.GeoCities.com/SiliconValley/Park/4218

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[Robert Schiller]

Max,

> I helped (along  with my RXDbase  and RXFile libs) starting/building at
least
> three big  projects here in Italy with  NetRexx,

I downloaded RXFile the other day.  It works beautifully.  Thank you.

> As a matter of fact, IBM is trying to  push everywhere VA Java, and
anyone
> knows about it. I've bought it, and  I'm helping others (mainly sw
developers)
> developing with it and  integrating it with NetRexx;

I've looked into VA Java and the system requirements took my breath away.

It seems ridiculous trying to get something as elegant as NetRexx working
with a 50 ton elephant.

Robert Schiller
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