Some questions on NetRexx open sourcing process

[Kermit Kiser]

Ren? ;

Something you wrote below about the expense of an Android phone that
runs NetRexx puzzles me. It is not clear to me if you were referring to
the cost of obtaining an Android phone or of using one or the cost to
develop Android applications in NetRexx or some combination of those things.

Many cellular providers now support Android models and some are probably
not too expensive. However, even if one cannot obtain or use an Android
phone (They are basically tiny laptop PCs running Linux that happen to
have a phone built in. ;-), the Android SDK includes an emulator which
allows one to create virtual phone devices of different types to test
applications on. This means that in theory you can develop Android
applications without even owning a phone. In practice, you should
probably test applications on a real device before publishing them on
the market!

BTW: My first published Android application written in NetRexx has been
on the Google Market for two weeks now and has picked up about 2600
users. Over 3500 people have tried it. (It is called "OneTouch Timer
Free".) I have issued two functionality upgrades already but am trying
to avoid irritating the users by issuing them too fast - an interesting
problem unique to a market that almost immediately informs users when an
upgrade is available!

-- Kermit


Ren? Jansen wrote:

> Hi David,
>
> those are a lot of questions, all perfectly valid  - and it is late so
> I'll answer you as compact as possible.
>
> The Ivory Tower council of savants impression actually made me laugh -
> if you would know them - us - you might not hand out compliments that
> easily. All people I know from RexxLA are quite the opposite - they
> will rewrite your code for you in the middle of the night just because
> it is Rexx and will visit the symposium just because they are friends.
>
> The tight lippedness about this process has got nothing to do with
> RexxLA. I would encourage you to be a member, because it is  - well -
> a fun group of people with a vast amount of knowledge about the
> granddaddy of scripting languages (not my words, I read that in
> "Programming Language Pragmatics") and/or the first alternative
> language for the JVM. And not expensive, at least not when you compare
> it to an iPhone. Or an Android phone (that actually runs NetRexx).
>
> About 1) and 2), I can, in my ivory tower way, only say: the work is
> done. Do not worry about this.
>
> 3) Yes, a language council is being set up for this purpose. Non
> members will also be involved, but will not be elegible for the
> ballpoint pens and stickers.
> 4) We are postponing any discussion about future language modification
> until the time for it is ripe. I know Martin's proposals and I have a
> few of my own. To start one discussion, I abhor Java generics syntax
> but like what it does. Maybe NetRexx can do this without syntax. The
> important part is, all things should be discussed and agreed, then
> documented, then implemented. It is the Rexx way. My personal priority
> is in annotations.
>
> 5) No. I am open for suggestions, but I happen to like NetRexx. This
> is probably something members get to vote on if they think it has to
> change.
>
> 6) No, you will not need to become a member, but why don't you join
> anyway?
>
> And this is 2010. Of course I am bound by several NDA's, one of them
> IBM, one of them the IBM account I work for, and several others I just
> signed because otherwise I cannot invoice people or get insurance.
> There is even one NDA, this is the truth, that I am not allowed to
> talk about. This should not have to keep us from having a fruitful
> discussion on language futures at all. It does explain however, the
> terseness of answers 1) and 2).
>
> Let me finish by expressing my gratitude to you for the resurrection
> of an important NetRexx tool - let us not allow this list to go quiet
> again.
>
> best regards,
>
> Ren?.

[rvjansen]

Hi Kermit,


it was half-joking when comparing it to the yearly price of a RexxLA membership. I intend to get one (although I am an iPhone user myself right now) just to be able to run netrexx on it.
I know the emulator and Daan Hoogland (who works for me at IBM) and I discuss Android stuff nearly every day  - he is an Android user.

I am very happy with you exploring Android as a new platform for netrexx and we should devote a large section of the website to it. I am just waiting out the Nexus / Android toolkit issues before taking the plunge.

best regards,

Ren? Jansen

On 9 feb 2010, at 22:58, Kermit Kiser wrote:

> Ren? ;
>
> Something you wrote below about the expense of an Android phone that runs NetRexx puzzles me. It is not clear to me if you were referring to the cost of obtaining an Android phone or of using one or the cost to develop Android applications in NetRexx or some combination of those things.
>
> Many cellular providers now support Android models and some are probably not too expensive. However, even if one cannot obtain or use an Android phone (They are basically tiny laptop PCs running Linux that happen to have a phone built in. ;-), the Android SDK includes an emulator which allows one to create virtual phone devices of different types to test applications on. This means that in theory you can develop Android applications without even owning a phone. In practice, you should probably test applications on a real device before publishing them on the market!
>
> BTW: My first published Android application written in NetRexx has been on the Google Market for two weeks now and has picked up about 2600 users. Over 3500 people have tried it. (It is called "OneTouch Timer Free".) I have issued two functionality upgrades already but am trying to avoid irritating the users by issuing them too fast - an interesting problem unique to a market that almost immediately informs users when an upgrade is available!
>
> -- Kermit
>
>
> Ren? Jansen wrote:
>> Hi David,
>>
>> those are a lot of questions, all perfectly valid  - and it is late so I'll answer you as compact as possible.
>>
>> The Ivory Tower council of savants impression actually made me laugh - if you would know them - us - you might not hand out compliments that easily. All people I know from RexxLA are quite the opposite - they will rewrite your code for you in the middle of the night just because it is Rexx and will visit the symposium just because they are friends.
>>
>> The tight lippedness about this process has got nothing to do with RexxLA. I would encourage you to be a member, because it is  - well - a fun group of people with a vast amount of knowledge about the granddaddy of scripting languages (not my words, I read that in "Programming Language Pragmatics") and/or the first alternative language for the JVM. And not expensive, at least not when you compare it to an iPhone. Or an Android phone (that actually runs NetRexx).
>>
>> About 1) and 2), I can, in my ivory tower way, only say: the work is done. Do not worry about this.
>>
>> 3) Yes, a language council is being set up for this purpose. Non members will also be involved, but will not be elegible for the ballpoint pens and stickers.
>> 4) We are postponing any discussion about future language modification until the time for it is ripe. I know Martin's proposals and I have a few of my own. To start one discussion, I abhor Java generics syntax but like what it does. Maybe NetRexx can do this without syntax. The important part is, all things should be discussed and agreed, then documented, then implemented. It is the Rexx way. My personal priority is in annotations.
>>
>> 5) No. I am open for suggestions, but I happen to like NetRexx. This is probably something members get to vote on if they think it has to change.
>>
>> 6) No, you will not need to become a member, but why don't you join anyway?
>>
>> And this is 2010. Of course I am bound by several NDA's, one of them IBM, one of them the IBM account I work for, and several others I just signed because otherwise I cannot invoice people or get insurance. There is even one NDA, this is the truth, that I am not allowed to talk about. This should not have to keep us from having a fruitful discussion on language futures at all. It does explain however, the terseness of answers 1) and 2).
>>
>> Let me finish by expressing my gratitude to you for the resurrection of an important NetRexx tool - let us not allow this list to go quiet again.
>>
>> best regards,
>>
>> Ren?.
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