NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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NetRexx project on SourceForge?
 
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Don´t you think it would be helpful to have NetRexx as a project listed in SourceForge.net too?.
Don´t get me wrong NetRexx.org is nice, but when/if (knock on wood, hope that never happens) it dissapears one day, the files disappear with it. (I don´t mean voluntarily disappear, imagine one day someone forgets to renew the netrexx.org domain name and it´s taken over by spammers -it happened to me with one of my domains). In any case, I think the more views the project gets, the more people will get attracted to it. Think of it in terms of having advertising in as many printed magazines as possible. Would you reject having a full-page ad for your project/product, if it´s free? I bet you wouldn´t. So, a NetRexx project on SourceForge.net will only bring more people to it. You could simply create a NetRexx project on SF.net and upload the same files which are now hosted on NetRexx.org. (I would go as far as to say that SourceForge.net is even better for distributing files, as the SF.net binaries are mirrored on dozens of Sourceforge mirror sites world-wide, and downloaders get the files closer to them. This is not a big deal for small projects like NetRexx but it surely helps others with bigger files). Just my $0.02... FC _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ |
Re: NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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Also, having users sign up for a mailing list at an IBM site could have its down side. For historical reasons, knowledge of NetRexx was almost entirely confined to IBM employees and customers. But, I assume, we intend to change that. Having NetRexx perceived as an "IBM thing" may have a negative connotation for some of our potential converts.
George On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 10:05 AM, Fernando Cassia <[hidden email]> wrote: Don´t you think it would be helpful to have NetRexx as a project listed in SourceForge.net too?. _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ |
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On 22 June 2011 08:10, George Hovey <[hidden email]> wrote: Also, having users sign up for a mailing list at an IBM site could have its down side. For historical reasons, knowledge of NetRexx was almost entirely confined to IBM employees and customers. But, I assume, we intend to change that. Having NetRexx perceived as an "IBM thing" may have a negative connotation for some of our potential converts. A.
-- Can't tweet, won't tweet! _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/
Alan
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In reply to this post by Fernando Cassia-2
If you search sourceforge.net for "netrexx", you find 3 projects - the
Rexx2Nrx translator, my Eclipse NetRexx plugin, and the NetRexx Incremental Compiler project (started by Rene in 2004 but which is currently essentially empty). OORexx is hosted there as well (with a total of 11 various OORexx efforts). Certainly Rene's project could be changed to include the kenai project, or at least have pointers to it. Setting up a sourceforge project is easy enough, and of course google code and possibly others are possibilities. The issue isn't setting up the projects, it's finding people to do the work in maintaining and adding to them. I'm restarting the Eclipse plugin work and will provide at least one more version (including full AST processing). I'll also include the netrexx3 Ant task there as well, and contribute that to the Apache Ant project in case they want it. Certainly enough people have downloaded the base NetRexx source by now that it is unlikely that it will get lost, but your point is well taken as time and changes occur. ____________________________________________________________________________ __ On 6/22/2011 10:05 AM, Fernando Cassia wrote: > Don´t you think it would be helpful to have NetRexx as a project listed in SourceForge.net too?. > > Don´t get me wrong NetRexx.org is nice, but when/if (knock on wood, hope that never happens) it dissapears one day, the files disappear with it. (I don´t mean voluntarily disappear, imagine one day someone forgets to renew the netrexx.org domain name and it´s taken over by spammers -it happened to me with one of my domains). > > In any case, I think the more views the project gets, the more people will get attracted to it. Think of it in terms of having advertising in as many printed magazines as possible. Would you reject having a full-page ad for your project/product, if it´s free? I bet you wouldn´t. > > So, a NetRexx project on SourceForge.net will only bring more people to it. You could simply create a NetRexx project on SF.net and upload the same files which are now hosted on NetRexx.org. > > (I would go as far as to say that SourceForge.net is even better for distributing files, as the SF.net binaries are mirrored on dozens of Sourceforge mirror sites world-wide, and downloaders get the files closer to them. This is not a big deal for small projects like NetRexx but it surely helps others with bigger files). > > Just my $0.02... > FC > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ibm-netrexx mailing list > [hidden email] > Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ -------------------------------------------------------------------- mail2web LIVE Free email based on Microsoft® Exchange technology - http://link.mail2web.com/LIVE _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ |
Re: NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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In reply to this post by alansam
On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 12:27, Alan Sampson <[hidden email]> wrote:
Oh come on, George has a point, to a degree. We´re speaking of software, not hardware. IBM and software rings "proprietary software", and "marketing failure". Think Lotus Smartsuite, OS/2, and Notes (perhaps the best software product still marketed by IBM)´ dimminishing market share... On the x86 PC hardware side, there was Microchannel and Token Ring. Not exactly success stories either. (On a personal note, I loved Thinkpads... and IBM should be ashamed for selling the PC Co. to Lenovo). I think George doesn´t want to erase all traces of Rexx´and NetRexx past IBM heritage. If I get what he means, he´s just saying that a mailing list hosted on a non-IBM domain (like netrexx.org or better, sourceforge.net) would make newcomers see it as a pure community-based open source project, and not associate it with the fortunes of any given company. FC _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ |
Re: NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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In reply to this post by alansam
Alan,
I've never worked for IBM, but I'm not an IBM basher. A recent Economist article covered IBM's 100 year history, and points out that it has continually reinvented itself while upstarts like Microsoft are in decline. [Fernando: dropping businesses like PCs and hard drives when they show signs of commoditization is singled out by Economist as shrewd business sense.] I'm also aware that it is one of the world's great private basic research organizations, on the level of Bell Labs in its prime. I also know that the academic world has traditionally been hostile to IBM and its works. This is indicative of an inferiority complex dating from the era when a large proportion of practical and theoretical accomplishments in computers came from IBM. I have worked with numerous academic computer gurus who expressed intense dislike of IBM, though they are gradually disappearing in favor of people who are simply unaware of IBM. I simply point out that it might be wise to stress the open source future rather than past glories. In a similar vein, a presence on Kenai seems to me a step in the right direction, as it suggests a commitment to Java. Perceptions matter. On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 11:27 AM, Alan Sampson <[hidden email]> wrote:
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Re: NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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In reply to this post by Fernando Cassia-2
Fernando,
Yes, that's what I meant. George On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 12:20 PM, Fernando Cassia <[hidden email]> wrote:
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Re: NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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In reply to this post by Fernando Cassia-2
http://download.cnet.com/windows/ Perl and Python are located there. The more places the better. Joe On 6/22/2011 9:05 AM, Fernando Cassia wrote: Don´t you think it would be helpful to have NetRexx as a project listed in SourceForge.net too?. _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ |
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In reply to this post by George Hovey-2
On 22 June 2011 10:58, George Hovey <[hidden email]> wrote:
A.
-- Can't tweet, won't tweet! _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/
Alan
-- Needs more cowbell. |
Re: NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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In reply to this post by George Hovey-2
On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 14:58, George Hovey <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I simply point out that it might be wise to stress the open source future > rather than past glories. In a similar vein, a presence on Kenai seems to > me a step in the right direction, as it suggests a commitment to Java. > Perceptions matter. My $0.02 : NetRexx.org, Kenai.com, SourceForge all are places to advertise NetRexx. Whenever someone looks for it, he should be able to find it there. (ie someone on Sourceforge typing "rexx" on the site´s internal search engine). Even if both Kenai and SourceForge projects all point back to NetRexx.org "for more info", uploading the files there takes little effort. It could even be automated with a batch / bash script so when a new release is uploaded to NetRexx.org, it is automagically mirrored to Kenai and SourceForge. :) Like I said, just an idea. :) FC _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ |
Re: NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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In reply to this post by alansam
On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 15:35, Alan Sampson <[hidden email]> wrote:
> In a similar vein; there is considerable hostility towards Oracle too, > particularly in the Open Source arena. Should we reconsider using Kenai > too? It's wholly owned by Oracle even if it is free. Both target different audiences. People who are "into Java" will surely look at Java.net/Kenai People who are "into linux" (and BSD) will look for stuff on SourceForge. Different communities, for different audiences. As NetRexx is of interest both to Linux devs *and* the Java crowd, my point is that it makes sense to be on both. It´s just an entry describing the project, after all. Uploads could then be "automagically" mirrored from NetRexx.org to the other sites... FC _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ |
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In reply to this post by Fernando Cassia-2
Hi Fernando,
yes, I remember nric. It was started by Chad Slaughter in the days there was no perspective on open sourcing; it fell apart for various reasons. The reason we went to Kenai is (apart from several people telling me they were fed up with SlashDots interface and changes thereof, is that there is much more integration with the Java community. NetRexx.org is donated to RexxLA; the associating will take care of its continuity. It is also in version management; for this reason it was easlly redeployable to amazon. If we have a NetRexx project on SF, I wonder what it should contain. Surely you don't mean for it to contain another copy of the source code? (Hmm, this is what you say in the next sentence). That would be inviting versioning trouble or creates the impression that it forked. What I wiil do, is to explain on the older SF project what happenend and where to get the open sourced version. In the meantime, how about a few more articles from our press officer? best regards, René. On 22 jun 2011, at 16:05, Fernando Cassia wrote: Don´t you think it would be helpful to have NetRexx as a project listed in SourceForge.net too?. _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ |
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In reply to this post by Joe Niffen
I agree with that - multiple places for the distributable package is cool; but the source really should be in one place.
best regards, René. On 22 jun 2011, at 20:28, Joe Niffen wrote:
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Re: NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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In reply to this post by alansam
A.
Good Point. BobH On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 10:27 AM, Alan Sampson <[hidden email]> wrote:
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Re: NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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In reply to this post by rvjansen
On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 15:56, René Jansen <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I agree with that - multiple places for the distributable package is cool; > but the source really should be in one place. > best regards, > René. I don´t think it´s such a big trouble to have the source and binaries mirrored on 3 sites, even while the two secondary mirrors (Kenai and SourceForge) would clearly state on the project description that the main site is www.netrexx.org. In fact, I see it the other way around: a single place means a "single point of failure". Sites ocassionaly go down for maintenance (Like Sourceforge or Kenai). And what trouble does it add? As long as you batch-upload every new release to all 3 sites, all will be fine (like I said, you could script that so with a single command it´s sequentially uploaded to all 3 sites). Take a look at "wput", a wget-like application, but which does uploads instead of downloads. http://wput.sourceforge.net/ I remember a time when files where mirrored on dozens of sites, world-wide... http://www.filesearch.ru/cgi-bin/s?q=pkz204g.exe&t=f&d=&x=0&y=0 http://www.filesearch.ru/cgi-bin/s?q=psp501ev.exe&t=f&w=a&x=0&y=0 Of course that´s my personal view, you don´t have to agree with me. FC _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ |
Re: NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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In reply to this post by rvjansen
On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 15:47, René Jansen <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > In the meantime, how about a few more articles from our press officer? I´ve been trying to chase Amazon.com to send me demo unit of the Kindle, so I can not only review it but try to see how difficult it´d be for a total newbie like me to create a sample Kindle app with its Kindle Java SDK using NetRexx. http://blogs.oracle.com/kharezlak/entry/amazon_kindle_sdk_kdk_uses Unfortunately my once-known PR contact, Patti Smith seems to have left the firm. And no, my freelancer´s pay does not allow me to buy every shiny new toy that is released. (plus, I expect firms that send review samples to pay for the import duties, which down here can add up to 50% of its invoice cost). So if anyone´s got a current lead/contact at Amazon, please let me know. FC _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ |
Re: NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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In reply to this post by alansam
Alan,
Perhaps that's right. George On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 2:35 PM, Alan Sampson <[hidden email]> wrote:
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Re: NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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In reply to this post by George Hovey-2
On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 14:58, George Hovey <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Alan, > I've never worked for IBM, but I'm not an IBM basher. A recent Economist > article covered IBM's 100 year history, and points out that it has > continually reinvented itself while upstarts like Microsoft are in decline. > [Fernando: dropping businesses like PCs and hard drives when they show signs > of commoditization is singled out by Economist as shrewd business sense.] > I'm also aware that it is one of the world's great private basic research > organizations, on the level of Bell Labs in its prime. I agree with the above. However, as of late I´ve seen IBM unable to market *ANY* mass market software product. In fact, I´d say that after Gerstner´s tenure, the firm has become more of a consulting company than a software company. This is sad, because as you say IBM has great research centers. However, that technology more often than not does NOT end as a consumer product success story. And IBM had leads on almost every field imaginable: pen writing (handwriting recognition), antivirus technology (IBM AV sold to Symantec), speech recognition (neglected then handed to Nuance for re-distribution), video streaming (IBM Hot.Media), internet telephony (IBM IC Phone from Haifa labs), desktop remote control (IBM Desktop on Call), web site authoring (IBM Homepage Builder)... I could go on for days. In every one of these market niches IBM´s offerings weren´t given enough attention or big-marketing push and others took the lead. So, yeah, IBM has tons of patents and great research centers. Many of these advancements are incorporated into big-ticket commercial products for Fortune 500 companies, but when it comes to the desktop and home users, you mention "IBM" these days to anyone and it´s hard to get a positive feedback or a mention of a piece of IBM software installed on the user´s computers. Microsoft knew very well how mind share works "from the bottom up", and first conquered desktops with Win95, then it worked its way up the chain to the office and IT admin´s mind. Similarly, Google first conquered the home users´ mind with GMail and GDocs, *then* everyone is more likely to consider Google Apps for their business. Sadly IBM is a niche corporate software vendor. And I see nothing that tells me someone up there realizes these challenges for its future and survival. Even donating the -now abandoned- Viavoice for Linux engine as open source would have given tons of good press, and would have probably put top-notch voice recognition into every Linux distro, on par with Vista and 7, if not better. FC _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ |
RE: NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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IBM is not a mass-market company and it will never will be... period!
But when it comes to consumer mass marketing stuff... Nintendo (Wii), Sony (Playstation) and Microsoft (Xbox) are fighting another, guess what is powering all three??? So most consumers don't even know they are using "IBM" on a daily basis :-) -----Original Message----- From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Fernando Cassia Sent: Wednesday, June 22, 2011 21:59 To: IBM Netrexx Subject: Re: [Ibm-netrexx] NetRexx project on SourceForge? On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 14:58, George Hovey <[hidden email]> wrote: > Alan, > I've never worked for IBM, but I'm not an IBM basher. A recent Economist > article covered IBM's 100 year history, and points out that it has > continually reinvented itself while upstarts like Microsoft are in decline. > [Fernando: dropping businesses like PCs and hard drives when they show signs > of commoditization is singled out by Economist as shrewd business sense.] > I'm also aware that it is one of the world's great private basic research > organizations, on the level of Bell Labs in its prime. I agree with the above. However, as of late I´ve seen IBM unable to market *ANY* mass market software product. In fact, I´d say that after Gerstner´s tenure, the firm has become more of a consulting company than a software company. This is sad, because as you say IBM has great research centers. However, that technology more often than not does NOT end as a consumer product success story. And IBM had leads on almost every field imaginable: pen writing (handwriting recognition), antivirus technology (IBM AV sold to Symantec), speech recognition (neglected then handed to Nuance for re-distribution), video streaming (IBM Hot.Media), internet telephony (IBM IC Phone from Haifa labs), desktop remote control (IBM Desktop on Call), web site authoring (IBM Homepage Builder)... I could go on for days. In every one of these market niches IBM´s offerings weren´t given enough attention or big-marketing push and others took the lead. So, yeah, IBM has tons of patents and great research centers. Many of these advancements are incorporated into big-ticket commercial products for Fortune 500 companies, but when it comes to the desktop and home users, you mention "IBM" these days to anyone and it´s hard to get a positive feedback or a mention of a piece of IBM software installed on the user´s computers. Microsoft knew very well how mind share works "from the bottom up", and first conquered desktops with Win95, then it worked its way up the chain to the office and IT admin´s mind. Similarly, Google first conquered the home users´ mind with GMail and GDocs, *then* everyone is more likely to consider Google Apps for their business. Sadly IBM is a niche corporate software vendor. And I see nothing that tells me someone up there realizes these challenges for its future and survival. Even donating the -now abandoned- Viavoice for Linux engine as open source would have given tons of good press, and would have probably put top-notch voice recognition into every Linux distro, on par with Vista and 7, if not better. FC _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ |
Re: NetRexx project on SourceForge?
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In reply to this post by Fernando Cassia-2
On 6/22/2011 2:27 PM, Fernando Cassia wrote:
> > In fact, I see it the other way around: a single place means a "single > point of failure". Sites ocassionaly go down for maintenance (Like > Sourceforge or Kenai). > > And what trouble does it add? As long as you batch-upload every new > release to all 3 sites, all will be fine (like I said, you could > script that so with a single command it´s sequentially uploaded to all > 3 sites). I don't have any strong feelings one way or another on where NetRexx lives, but those two paragraphs contradict one another. If you want NetRexx on multiple sites, and one or more of those sites is down, then the batch-upload will fail, and the unavailable sites with immediately be out of sync with the "master" copy. Note: I'm not saying multiple hosts is a bad idea, only that you can't have it both ways. Tom. _______________________________________________ Ibm-netrexx mailing list [hidden email] Online Archive : http://ibm-netrexx.215625.n3.nabble.com/ |
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